Anime Subbed or dubbed OOH CONTROVERSY!

By Sonic Reducer. 29/01/10, 02:38 pm

Thats what I mean though. To me it ammounts to nothing short of being a contest and being the best at the sub-culture you elected yourself apart of.

Take the goth culture as a random example, the pseudo goth community will be based off of people who listen to marilyn manson and MSI, watch Tim Burton and read SLG comics. All the popular mainstream ways of identifying themselves as part of this culture (in the anime realm, buying popular anime I.E Death Note, Bebop, etc etc) Watching it subbed and calling themselves anime geeks.

Now the "real" goths will cringe at these pseudo goths because they are only taking the mainstream options, they will however listen to stuff like The Cure and read things like Dante's Inferno or whatever. Now the "otaku" anime fan will import the series from japan, only watch dubbed and be able to list off any non popular anime (usually not popular for a bloody good reason) as their favourites.

When trying to identify with subcultures we get into a game of "i have to be the best at this culture ever". which to me is mind numbing. And worst of all removes all sincerty of liking the culture and everything else.

Dub isn't weak copy but more of a faithful adaptation for an audience that wouldn't otherwise be aware of it. Much how most of japanese culture seems to mimic western. Its obvious they have adapted it their own way and go through the same argument we do here (as shown but that oh so clever comic strip which someone will likely post after my mentioning of it).

My point is there is no cultural indenty no matter how hard you try. We arent goths and otakus and whatever. We're humans. We should like what we like because we enjoy it, not because its taboo to watch something dubbed or listen to a non japanese band or whatever. Break you chains people! be free!

By Luzkan. 29/01/10, 02:43 pm

Well the thing with subs is you tend to miss some of the story or humor as anyone who has seen an English movie with subs will tell you they cut down on the text to save room there for you can miss key bits which are in there to be funny or to point to a plot twist that you did not see coming.

Tho i still like subs over dubs not sure why that's just IMO

By H-idenshi. 29/01/10, 05:03 pm

Nonetheless, otaku is my religion, moe is my god and my mind, body and soul are made of infinite memes. ┐(´ー｀)┌

By Sonic Reducer. 29/01/10, 05:06 pm

seems far too common these days. which is why i rigid the centre of the earth with explosives. fantastic!

By Squishy blob. 29/01/10, 05:38 pm

Sonic Reducer wrote:: Thats what I mean though. To me it ammounts to nothing short of being a contest and being the best at the sub-culture you elected yourself apart of. Take the goth culture as a random example, the pseudo goth community will be based off of people who listen to marilyn manson and MSI, watch Tim Burton and read SLG comics. All the popular mainstream ways of identifying themselves as part of this culture (in the anime realm, buying popular anime I.E Death Note, Bebop, etc etc) Watching it subbed and calling themselves anime geeks.
Now the "real" goths will cringe at these pseudo goths because they are only taking the mainstream options, they will however listen to stuff like The Cure and read things like Dante's Inferno or whatever. Now the "otaku" anime fan will import the series from japan, only watch dubbed and be able to list off any non popular anime (usually not popular for a bloody good reason) as their favourites.
When trying to identify with subcultures we get into a game of "i have to be the best at this culture ever". which to me is mind numbing. And worst of all removes all sincerty of liking the culture and everything else.

Now somewhere within that huge quote is a practice that is very much alive today- trying to be the most faithful and dedicated of a subculture. As an individual i feel no desire to exclusively become an anime or (jmusic) fan and write off other forms of entertainment because they do not fit into a certain category. I would find no satisfaction in becoming the epitome of what makes a certain subculture different from the rest, and think that telling people that I only watch subs or listen to japanese music would neither improve my social standing nor self satisfaction.

My bottom line is that if i like something, I LIKE IT. If something makes me happy, be it a well translated joke, corny angst or cheap moe, then I'll keep liking it regardless. And I'd use that to defend my liking of many "mainstream, cultivated for the masses" anime and manga series, because even when you can tell some people in the production team are trying a bit too hard to please, sometimes it works.

Proof of my "if I like it, I like it" policy in action is my ipod... Play counts tell all.

As for the actual subs and dubs argument, I'm pretty versatile, and I like to think that i judge on a case by case basis. It's all been said. "some subs are good, some dubs are too, I get tired or want to multitask, I like to understand why jokes are funny."

And as for youtubers, I know there's an xkcd strip somewhere that sums up the nature of most of their comments.

By Sonic Reducer. 29/01/10, 06:29 pm

thanks squishy bob.

I mean thats exactly the point im trying to make. Too many will use their usage of the elite as a social ladder,as in watching only subs will give them more cool points or listening to all the Jrock in the world of whatever.

It should be about what you like and what you enjoy and anything else should come last.

Also note my point is not that all people who watch subs are doing it for the cool points, my point is there shouldnt be an arguement about it, it shouldnt matter that you enjoy subs more and the new member of this forum or that anime club or whatever has only watched dubs. That shouldn't even come up in conversation other than say you have a screening and you ask the group "what would you all prefer, subs or dubs?" and pick whats gonna be most suited to the group.

To me thats the only time it should be relavent whether someone is a sub or a dub watcher because then you're catering to someone beyond you and your bedroom or lounge or whether you do your most viewing. I mean I really don't care what you do in your home, its none of my business, least of all do i care which way you're watching your anime shows. Its the same show, the redubbing very rarely takes away from what the original had and the changes are more often things like taking yen to dollars or something cultural like that. sure that can be a tad annoying seeing as it is a japanese product and turning the in show currency to dollars is a tad absurd, but that doesn't effect my enjoyment of the show. Even less so if i prefer the sound the dub has or am with a good friend enjoying it or whatever. Im more worried where im getting my next meal from than whether bilyl watches the dubbed version of souleater or whatever.

Again to clear up things even further, this rant isn't to attack the OP, its now the generic question, the problem isnt that people asked it but that it ever got asked.

By deceptivemagick. 30/01/10, 12:40 am

personally i like subs solely because im used to them. almost any series i want to watch isnt out in english when i watch it and when it is out dubbed i get weirded out by the changes in voices. but there have been series where i prefer of enjoy dubs such as ouran, xxxholic, gto, etc.

By **JVCA**. 30/01/10, 01:03 am

...yes, there already was a thread on this topic - on the first page. sweatdrop

Making duplicate topics is a kind of spam - please check next time. :) I have merged the two topics together.

By Max Power. 30/01/10, 01:22 am

I like both XD
depends on how sore my eyes are as to if I wanna read subtitles or not XD

By **jpwise**. 30/01/10, 01:27 am

I'm a fan of subs, mostly because they're easier to just relax and watch, but at the same time I watch alot of subs aswell, mostly because the anime hasn't been released in dub form yet. I don' thave a massive leaning of one over the other, but since my japanese still leaves alot to be desired subs can be interesting to watch aswell. :)

**Guest** Guest

Subbed all the way, I prefer the characters to have their original voices in anime.

By DarkGaia. 30/01/10, 11:09 am

Um, I said in my original thread I liked dubs better, I dont like reading subtitles >>, unless I absolutely have to, not saying Japanese dubs are bad, I actually think most of the time the voices a better, but Ill always choose dubs over subs from my force of lazyness xD

**Guest** Guest

japanese dubs for me are wayyyyyyyy better.

you get more emotion put into the VA-ing, I always take higurashi no naku koro ni as an example. Seriously? who picked the cast @__@. I refuse to watch the dub of higurashi.

By DarkGaia. 30/01/10, 11:20 am

Kiki wrote:: japanese dubs for me are wayyyyyyyy better.

you get more emotion put into the VA-ing, I always take higurashi no naku koro ni as an example. Seriously? who picked the cast @__@. I refuse to watch the dub of higurashi.

xD, I noticed, I havent seen the anime myself, but im so lazy so Ill take the risk :3

Itll be hard for me to get used to clannad when its dubbed, thats for sure >>;;

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

(Gahh, this is confusing, Im not the author of this thread, I posted a different one, maybe the mods too it down, but why does it say im the author of.... oh screw it, to much thinking D : )

**Guest** Guest

..wait i said japanese dubs.... i meant subs Dx

By DarkGaia. 30/01/10, 11:28 am

Lolz, I think theyre both Voice acting over an animation, so theyre just two types of dubs, the japanese is conidered the original because, the anime was made in japan, and dubbed 1st in japanese, I refer to it as J-dub, not usually Original (Even though it is - -'',,,, im contridicting myself again)

By Sonic Reducer. 30/01/10, 12:20 pm

I agree. both are essentially the same job, people recording voices over an animated clip. So generally even though it is often first recorded in Japan, its not like it was only intended to be done there.

I mean we can also look at it in video games, do we want to play a video game that was recorded in its "original" voice cast?

By DarkGaia. 30/01/10, 01:41 pm

Sonic Reducer wrote:: I agree. both are essentially the same job, people recording voices over an animated clip. So generally even though it is often first recorded in Japan, its not like it was only intended to be done there.

I mean we can also look at it in video games, do we want to play a video game that was recorded in its "original" voice cast?

yeah, your right, It doesnt matter what you listen to, if you like it, its fine Anime Subbed or dubbed OOH CONTROVERSY! - Page 3 Icon_neutral

Thats what weeaboos wont realise, if you dont like japanese dubs, theyll murder you (Hypatheticaly speaking)

**Guest** Guest

Blargh idec.

my opinion still stands. I personally think the japanese subbed versions are so much better, some dubs are good, but I can't stand most of them.

so yeah :3

By Kat. 30/01/10, 01:52 pm

I prefer the original voices in games and anime
to be perfectly honested I think the english dubs in games and anime butcher the story and the characters in 95% of cases

and a dub is where you replace the original soundtrack (usually just the voice track but sometimes they do music as well) with a new one
if you consider the original voices for an anime a dub then you would consider the original voices in a film dubs

**Guest** Guest

dubs in games dnw ever.

>__<

except disney characters and songs in Kingdom hearts. Listen to under the sea japanese vers. it scarred me for life lololol

By H-idenshi. 31/01/10, 02:10 am

Just a little piece of handy information for people that tend to see the foreign language adaptions and Japanese original as both being 'dubs'.

There is a perception difference here at a linguistic level. (putting aside the transforming use of the term dubbing from its original meaning)
In Japanese there is a separate terminology for the process of taking something from one country/language, dubbing over and releasing/broadcasting as a foreign language version.
This is called: 吹き替え[fukikae] literally meaning the change/substitution of blowing (wind). The 'blowing' term here is the same verb used for 'blowing' of a wind instrument if you get the picture.
This terminology is never used for the initial recording in national products.

(random text wall)*⌒ ヽ(´ｰ｀ ) *runs off*

By Squishy blob. 31/01/10, 02:16 am

Kiki wrote:: japanese dubs for me are wayyyyyyyy better.

you get more emotion put into the VA-ing, I always take higurashi no naku koro ni as an example. Seriously? who picked the cast @__@. I refuse to watch the dub of higurashi.

Higurashi dub was sooooo budget. Or just plain low quality.

For me, there's always the curiosity factor. When my favourite animes are dubbed in english, I like to watch an episode or two on youtube to "see how they did it."

Li-Bai wrote:: There's a phrase that gets used a lot on the Voice Acting Alliance forums that goes 'LOL YouTube'. It's a pretty clear message - you should never really take ~~some~~ a lot of 'Tubers seriously in these aspects. (I mean come on, it's YouTube!)

LOL YouTube:
http://xkcd.com/202/
http://xkcd.com/481/

And it's a real shame how alot of game studios seem to put absolutely no effort into the voices/voice acting of characters. Luckily I think there's been a step towards the future in many western games in trying to make the faces and voices of characters realistic and fitting. I just hope they do the same when they dub foreign games too.

By Sonic Reducer. 31/01/10, 04:28 am

@Kat

No, no i wouldn't call them dubs.. thats just silly.. if you were a real cat i would put you out in the rain for the mere suggestion of that.

In film the voices are often taken as is, unless for specific reasons that they have to redub it or that is narration, but more often than not they elect an actor on look, and vocal style.

In animation, Japanese, russian, french, martian, whatever, they draw a character, often animate the entire movie or few episodes, start screaming throwing things around when they realise that no body actually sounds like this drawing of a giant half dog half cactus being known as lord sniffles until some 40 year old woman walks in the room and they some how claim she sounds like a boy.

No really. thats what happens, i've worked in every animated show world wide and they have since banned me because of my cactus dogs.

My point minus that warped bat-fowling horn-beast nature of mine is that in film that whole thing is already set in stone by the time the camera rolls, the original isnt a dub since it is how it is, however with any animation, whether it be cartoon or 3d or vdeo game or pickle, the voices often come well into the work being complete (though very rarely not, however the character is already designed and the show storyboarded).

But yes, how do you claim whats the original in kingdom hearts? now you have japanese characters mixed with western ones... do you have to switch the vocal track over regarding who is talking? I mean this not in a rude way in the slightest but thats all you can do if you sincerly believe that "original is better".

What should the Japanese do with out products as well? sub or dub them?

By DarkGaia. 31/01/10, 04:28 am

Well, I recon they did good with Final fantasy :\

The voices dont completely match the mouthing, because its 3d, and made to fit the japanese dub, but other than that, I think they did a fair job (I cant watch the dub for Advent children though >_< , Im to used to the japanese version)

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